All right, folks. Welcome to Nino's Corner TV. This is a this is a good one. This is going to be a good one. I am with Joe Jordan, a international CAG field investigator for MUFON, and what we're going to be talking about today is really controversial because it's really a subject nobody wants to bring up, especially at MUFON or UFO conferences that I've gone to. I've never heard anything like this. 

I've heard whispers about this, but no one's ever really brought it out. They don't want to bring it out to the light. And that is how do you stop alien abductions? There is a way that's on record that nobody's talking about where you can stop an alien abduction. But before I get into that, folks, get your Noble Gold. Feeling unsure about your finances these days? You're not alone. 

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com now. Noblegoldinvestments. com. All right. Wow, Joe, I'm really looking forward to this know, because there's always that conversation out there. There's always that debate, are they extraterrestrials or are they interdimensional beings or are they fallen angels? Are they all of the above? What are we looking at here, first of all? What are aliens in your view? Well, Nino, first, thanks for having me on. I know this is going to be challenging for a lot of your followers out there, what I'm getting ready to present for you. 

But my culmination of 30 years of research, 25 of it from a perspective that I was kind of forced to look at. It's not one I chose, but it's one that I had to look at because of some early cases that I had come across that were pointing in that direction and that was taking this phenomenon and looking at it, especially the abduction phenomenon, from a biblical perspective. 

And in my findings, if I take everything that I've learned over these 30 years and kind of tally it up with what the Bible says, then what we're seeing here is what would be classified as spiritual entities that are perpetrating a delusion on humanity. You're telling me that you could confidently say these are fallen angels perpetrating as aliens? Maybe, yes. What we're seeing is a major delusion that's being presented. 

Because what I see in this UFO phenomenon and the UFO community is anyone that this is the major, I believe, purpose of this phenomenon is it takes people's eyes. Away from the one true God of the Bible in every single instance of people that become involved in it or people that have been affected by it. I can say that happened to me because my awakening process I like to say it's a process happened early, early on, 20 something years ago. 

I really dove headfirst into the alien phenomena and that started leading me away from the Bible. It really did. It started leading me astray from the Bible. And I was like, well, look, if there's life on other planets, if the universe is that big I always believed in evolution. It was no doubt in my mind, well, the Bible is just archaic. And it's just a bunch of people that were having visions that weren't really talking to God, but they were just delusional. 

And that's old text that's thousands of years old. It's time to get with the times. There's aliens, there's other planets out there. Obviously, NASA. What happened was when I left, my awakening process went like this right back at the Bible. That's what happened. And I'm amazed by that because the more I'm looking into this, the more I'm going back to the Bible. You're telling my own testimony here with your testimony. 

I didn't start out into this phenomenon as a Christian, looking at this from a biblical perspective. I grew up in the church, but never really accepted it as a youngster. Walked away from it in high school, got ate up by everything of the world. And then when I came to this phenomenon, I entered this phenomenon in 1992 with no interest in it at all. It was all because of one book I picked up and read that just opened up the can of worms for me with 1000 questions I needed answered. 

And it was UFO crash at Roswell. I was an agnostic humanist at the time, like yourself was at one point. Everything was pointing to evolution being real. There was no God. We're here to survive and make it through our life. And that's the end. But it was through this research, it's through the step by step process of trying to understand what this phenomenon was, being trained in investigation, being trained how to do proper research, that it finally led me to this perspective of Christianity, which I became a believer in Jesus Christ in 1996. 

And because of that, I wanted to look at this. Well, what does Jesus and the Bible say about this phenomenon? And it was in this part of the research that I came across his first important, interesting case study into abductions with a gentleman that said that he had stopped his experience while it was happening in the name and authority of Jesus Christ. This was 1996. And back then, after reading all the research and consuming all the information I could about abductions, as I was beginning into researching abductions, two things that I found from the research community was they didn't know why this happened to certain people. 

And they said that these experiences could not be stopped. What I found in my research over the past 25 years is answers to both of those questions, and they're still looking for the answer for those questions. But with over 600 case studies that I've done and they're still climbing because they constantly come in, it's still supporting the same answers that I found. That it can be stopped, especially as a life pattern, means it stops it from happening again through the name and authority of Jesus Christ and a relationship with him. 

And then the question of why does this happen to certain people? This was the most fascinating part. First reason people ask for it. Seriously? They do. I did. And many people out there do. So you invited these entities into your life by one? Sure. I didn't know who they were. I just wanted to know what this experience was about. Did you have an experience? It was not an abduction experience, per se. 

I don't recall anything about being taken anywhere on a ship or anything like that. But it was a middle of the night experience, waking up knowing there was a presence in the room. I had weapons in my room that I slept with. I slept. So when I shot up out of bed, I was grabbing a pistol and I was ready to take on whatever was that presence in the room. 

As my eyes started to focus and I started to look around and get my night sight, I realized that there was nothing there. But at the same time, I was in this fight or flight situation to where I just had this adrenaline rush going on in sheer fear that what was this? It took a while to calm down, but while I was trying to calm down, I realized I was also getting a download of information that I couldn't even grasp. 

It was coming in so fast. It was, like, in picture form. It was like the questions of the universe being answered to me in this download. And it was over the next four or five years, as I explored the craziness of this phenomenon into the new age and metaphysical realm, was I able to start seeing what that information was. It's like every time I learned something new, oh, I know that. 

I know that. And then again, something new. I know that too. But, you know, it all wore off finally after about four years. I wasn't recognizing anything that I had been given. In the beginning, it was basically worthless information that I was given by these entities. But it was something that sucked me in. It was something that was seductive to me. It built my ego up that I was like I was special. 

I was chosen for this. And this is something I see over and over through the case studies that I've done. But when I finally got to that point where actually it was a point in my life where I was pretty worn down that somebody stepped in and said, hey, you need protection in this realm. And I said, what kind of protection? I've got these nice gemstones I carry. 

I know from everything. Yeah. And this person said, no, I think it's here in the Bible. And I took that moment and let them share this gospel message with me. And I realized that protection it was offering is something possibly way more than what I thought I had. More than your little crystals you carried in your pocket? Oh, yeah. And I found out it was way more powerful than anything I had come across in a new age metaphysical realm. 

So eventually I became a Christian, and then I took on looking at this through the eyes of a Christian and the Bible. So, in essence, I've had the opportunity, unlike most researchers out there, to look at this phenomenon from three distinct viewpoints. One as an agnostic humanist, one through the eyes of a new age metaphysical person, and another one through the Christian. The eyes of a Christian. And it wasn't until I became a Christian and started looking at it through the biblical lens that I start finding the answers to this phenomenon, answers that nobody else is finding. 

Maybe some are finding, but it's one that's unaccepted. I call it the unwanted piece of the UFO puzzle. Why is everyone just shutting this information out in MUFON? Why do they not want to discuss this? Why do they want to just turn their backs on this and just give it a cold shoulder? Why? I don't understand. Because everyone's all great Christian, the Bible beaters here. We don't want to hear this garbage. 

I mean, why do they shut this out? It's not really for that reason. I've had the opportunity to talk to five of the last seven international directors of MUFON over the past 30 years. Even had an opportunity to talk to the founder, Walter andrus himself, and share this information about what I had found 30 years ago. When I talk to them and I share the information, they're open to it as a possibility. 

They don't shut me down. It's just that this is not a stance that MUFON can take. Keep in mind MUFON's mission statement the scientific investigation of UFOs for the benefit of humanity. So they have to remain neutral? Yeah, they have to remain neutral. They can't be pushing a religion. No, they can't push any side. They do not take a stand at all on what this is. Is there any documented cases of people stopping these abductions in the name of, I don't know, Buddha, Allah, I mean, any other religions? Is there any of those documented cases where they stopped it in the name of their religion? You know, I've asked for that for 25 years, since I started this as a Christian. 

I don't have those cases. So the only documented cases of it stopping is in the name of Jesus Christ. That's what I have. I challenge people over the years to bring that information forward. The closest I've come was talking to Farah Yodorzu, the Turkish researcher, and she talked about because they believe as Muslims, that these are the Jinn, which are still angelic beings. It's just that they don't recognizing them as fallen angelic beings. 

They recognize him as God's messengers. They don't understand that there was a war in heaven like the Christian Bible shows. But they do agree that these are the Jinn. And the thing is, in those cases, she reported that there were times where you could call and stop these beings through your belief in Allah. The thing is well, the difference is that being these are the same fallen entities that the Christian side is. 

They let you believe that you have control, but you actually don't. And they leave you with something that is they call it a gift coming from the gym if you have encounters with them. But these gifts are nothing that we would say that is a good thing. They believe it is because you might get the gift of prophecy where you can read people's fortunes or their future and things like that, but it's not accurate all the time. 

So it's a false gift. It's just one that keeps you hooked. And in the biblical sense, we don't see that they're the same deceptive entities as a Gin. And you're not going to receive any gift from them at all, except that it's going to pull you away from the true God. I've had my experiences with the Gin when I was like 27 years old. I was attacked by a Gin. 

They're like shadow people, correct? Yes. It was like a child and it was sitting on my chest when I was they believe that that's what I've listened to podcasters on the Muslim side and the workings going on at Skinwalker Ranch. They say. Yeah, that's gin, you know. So how many of these documented cases are there that have people have rebuked these abductions in the name of Jesus Christ? You said over 600 or what did you say? I've worked with over 600 over the past 25 years and they're still coming in every time I do a document. 

Yeah, I've got the testimonies. Is there any go ahead. That's the one thing that I wanted to make sure that people were aware of. And I make them public. I make them on my website. I've had them in my new book, Piercing the Cosmic Veil, that we just put out in 2020, which is on Amazon. There's over 60 of the testimonies here in the backside of this book. 

I was going to cosmic Veil folks get that on Amazon. Yeah, I was going to put 100 of them in there, but the book was too big to publish for that. And I said I got to cut it down. But on my website, Cefore Research, there's another couple of hundred on there, and I still have some that I need to get posted up. But they continue to come in. 

The more people I talk to that have never heard this, that are possibly sitting on a testimony like that, now they know who to talk to. Because that was the problem in the very beginning. When I first got come across that first case, I said, this has got to be a hoax or it's got to be a mistake or the guys was just dreaming or something. So I took it to the leading researchers at the time. 

I looked their names up in a phone book. That's what we had back then. We had landlines so I could find them and I talked to them personally and I said, guys, help me out with this unusual case I've got. It doesn't make sense to me. And after I shared the story with them, every single one of them said, can we go off the record from here on? And I said, sure, we can go off the record. 

As a MUFON representative, I have to respect anonymity when somebody asks for it. But I can tell you what they said. I just can't tell you the names of who I talked to. Every one of them shared with me that they too had come across cases like this where people had hummed a hymn, said Scripture called to Jesus, any number of ways that had to do with a biblical connection that these experiences stopped. 

And I said, wait a minute. All of you guys report that this can't be stopped. So now you're telling me you do have cases like this? And I said, Why is it not being published that there is this possibility of termination? And they said, first answer, we didn't know what to make of this. And I was fine with that. I would have taken that just fine. You didn't understand. 

Okay, but I don't know if their conscious bothered them or what, but they follow up with a second answer every time. We were afraid to go there because it might affect our credibility in the UFO research community. Well, I'm not afraid and you're not afraid. Isn't that called a cover up? Yeah. So we've been hearing cover up with the government for 30 years, 40 years, 50 years. But let me tell you folks, the leading researchers in the realm are covering up to fit their own agendas. 

And that's one thing I told them, I'm not going to do that. Thank you for giving me that. There's other cases out there verifying that and verifying this case was real. I'm going to go find those other cases. I'm going to make myself known to receive these cases, and I'm going to bring them to documentation so that the unwanted piece of the puzzle can finally be seen. And that's what I've been doing for 25 years with Ce four research. 

A lot of people that have been abducted, they have to go through a hypnosis correct to remember these accounts. Or do they don't remember them. All this is something I found in my research that's definitely challenging to the UFO community. They actually believe that people are being taken somewhere. They believe that this experience is absolutely physical experience. I never use hypnosis. Hypnosis has been found to be fallible. 

I don't want to use anything that could challenge the work that I'm doing and the findings that I have. I'm a safety professional by trade. I learned how to do investigations not just from MUFON, but through my safety profession because I do incident investigations where you have to get to the root cause of an investigation to be able to do a corrective action that's going to keep it from happening again. 

Those investigations are done by asking the right questions. You don't need hypnosis to do that. They're looking for the missing pieces that they can't remember. I found that it's not that they can't remember because what secular researchers say, the entities put a block on their mind. I didn't find that at all to be the reason. I found it much more simpler than that. What we started to see was the similarity between what these people were saying during their testimonial of their experiences. 

It was being very similar to what we were hearing from people who had had stage hypnosis activity, where they went up on stage and let a hypnotist do something with them firsthand. I've seen it work. So afterwards, if you talk to them, they have no recall of what happened to them. And these hypnotists are only using the power of suggestion to get them to believe what they want them to believe. 

Okay, so here's what I'm trying to get at here. These people that have given you the count, you've spoke to 600 people. Correct. Each one of them remember firsthand. They remember their experiences. What I'm asking is they didn't have to go through hypnosis to remember these experiences. They remember firsthand. Yes. And what I found is the parts that they don't remember because of the similarity we saw with stage hypnosis people, I had to go back and re ask questions and have them relive their experience and ask more questions. 

When they got to a part where they believe they were sitting on a table in a ship, I would ask them questions like, tell me what you see to the left. Tell me what you see to the right. Tell me what you see down or up, what's the temperature is. There a breeze blowing from air conditioning. All these things that should be remembered if the experience was real is not there. 

It's just like if I ask you what your last birthday was like, you can remember your last birthday, but you're not going to remember all of it because your mind wants to retain the most sensational, happy things that you had on your birthday. But Nino, if I sit you down and I take you question by question, I will get you to relive that birthday like you never imagined that was actually happening. 

Because your brain is recording everything in real time and it keeps it there. It's just a matter of what your conscious decides to choose to be in the forefront. So when I re interviewed them and went to look back for the part that they obviously thought was not important, it wasn't there. So what I realized was happening here is this was like a play. If you go to a play and you're sitting in the audience and they're doing a scene change and they bring out these two walls. 

And on the walls is a window, a door on one, maybe a fireplace on the other. They bring out a couch, a chair, an end table. What's the scene? The scene is a living room. But is all the details there, like your living room? No, it's not needed to give you the concept of this is a living room. So the whole thing here is what they're being given is a spiritual visionary experience during the sleep state that is, impacting sensational. 

Just enough information for them to be believing that it's real. It doesn't need to have all the details. The best example I can give you is the movie The Matrix, the first Matrix. Most everybody's seen that movie. When Neo goes to the submarine and they put him on that table and they plug him into the back of the head. He goes to a white space and what's in that white space? Things start showing up a TV, a couch, a table, a chair just like the living room in a play. 

And then Morpheus is there. Let me ask the question now, where's Neo? He's still on the bed on that consciousness that they're this is the abduction so they're intercepting his consciousness. This is the abduction experience. So these beings aren't necessarily from another planet, another galaxy, another solar system. They're entities from the spiritual world giving us this illusion. Yes, because it's an illusion. Because they're perpetrating a delusion. Wow. 

That take us away from the one true God. Now, don't think that there's not physical manifestations. That's the other side of the UFO phenomena. That's what we're seeing with these Tic TACs, these gimbal, these scenes we're seeing in the sky, that 2% that MUFON says we don't know what these are. The other 98% is Misidentified natural phenomenon or manmade phenomenon. But those 2%, the ones that are now calling EAPs, those things defy our physics as we know it. 

I've seen it not a problem if you're looking at an angelic being, that's not a problem for them. That's their natural ability. You know, Jack Sarfardi, the physicist, he describes what we're seeing as a skin giving us appearance of what they want us to see. And the inside of this skin whatever that appearance is, is consciousness. This is coming from a secular physicist saying this. That's phenomenal. He's describing manifestation, spiritual manifestation. 

Science could only understand this in the eyes of technology. They're trying to say that there's a super technology that these beings have. I say that this is not technology at all. This is angelic being natural ability to manifest in any form they want as a human, as an entity of any appearance, as a craft of any sort. But it's just a manifestation. It's the skin with them as the consciousness behind it. 

So this goes hand in hand with what the globalist would want to accomplish or Satan would want to accomplish with this alien card that they're getting ready to play in the future where we're going to be threatened by aliens or we're going to have an intervention from aliens to teach us how to protect the Earth and this and that. This would go hand in hand with that. This is directly from I guess I'm going to say it now. 

This is directly mean. This is all delusion and illusions, right? This is all trickery. But here's the scary part. Satan and his minions are perpetrating this delusion. But the question is, who's the puppet master? What would be puppet master? If we agree that this is biblical, then we have to believe it's coming from God's word. And what I found in God's word in two, thessalonians chapter two, verse ten through 13 is god sends this strong delusion to test our faith. 

Yes. This is the separation from the weak, from the chaff. People are going to choose this lie. And this is not something that you're going to be dealing with temporarily. This is going to be an eternal choice that you make. That's what this delusion is about. This is why these entities are limited on what they're able to do with this so called high technology that they appear to have. 

They could wipe us out at any time. They could kill us at any time. We don't see that that's not happening because it's a battle for our souls. Our souls are the most important real estate. Right, exactly. And God has limited them on what they're able to do. But what I see in case after case after case with these abduction experiences, they can drive you to insanity where you'll kill yourself. 

So what is demon possession? Demon possession is the same thing. I mean, when you look at people that have sometimes I watch these police interrogation videos and a lot of these people will say, man, it wasn't me. I don't know what happened, I just lost it, or, I wasn't thinking. Something came over me. And it's the same theme for a lot of these people. And I think to myself, are these entities entering their body and going for a ride like an amusement park? You know what I mean? I'm sober now three years and nine months and I remember when I would drink, I would do things that was so out of character, and it was because I really feel like that's why they call it liquor and spirits or beer and spirits, or because I feel like I was giving permission away to these entities. 

What's your thoughts on that? There's three questions that I would ask people, and this really gets people upset just looking at this. To determine whether you might be an abduction experiencer, first question, have you ever had instances where you catch yourself and go, man, what happened to the last hour? I can't even remember the last hour. You catch yourself and you go, wow, it's like being on the highway, and you're driving along, and all of a sudden, you catch yourself and you go, man, you know, you've been driving. 

You're still behind the wheel, but you can't remember the last half hour. You can't remember what you passed. You can't remember seeing anything that's missing time. Okay, people have this. So that's one, the second one. Have you ever caught yourself and realized, how did I get here? You've been doing something, but you don't recognize and don't remember what you were doing, but you find yourself in a position. 

You go, how did I get here? That's two questions. The third one, and this really gets crazy. Have you ever had marks or scars on your body that you don't know how you got them? That's a yes. All the above for me. That hits in the head for boxing. Now, you know where else those questions are asked? Those same questions with multiple personality disorder and demon possession. Wow. 

Yeah, the same. Wow. So and the way you stop a demon possession every time is through the name of Jesus Christ. That's how you rebuke and stop that's. But I've never heard them stopping it in the name of Buddha or you know what I mean? Correct. This is how you stop demon possessions and how you stop alien abductions. It's one and the you know, there are some powerful quotes here that just came out I'd like to share with states. 

Leslie Keene states, the paranormal elements of the UFO phenomenon seem to have some relationship to what people describe in near death experience. She adds, as a paranormal, mysterious, and complicated side of the UFO reports that may be connected to ghosts and the supernatural. She's definitely not a Christian. Ron James, director of media relations for the UFO network, claims there is a very large contingent of people within the Pentagon who oppose the work of the ATIP program because they think the UAPs, regularly reported by US. 

Military sources, are piloted from creatures from hell. In a recent podcast interview, professor Gary Nolan of Sanford was asked in the interviewer, asked by the interviewer, you have told me that you believe on evidence that there is a non human technologies on this planet. Professor Gary Nolan says advanced capabilities I don't. Know if it's a technology per se. I'm leaving it open to the idea that it's some form of consciousness that is non material. 

Then there's Jim Semmivan. Former CIA agent. Yes. That there is a force out there that can control our environment and put thoughts in our heads. They can lie to you, deceive you, and you are not in control of your life. And then here's the clincher. This is John De Souza, former FBI agent. The X Man. I've had him. Yeah. What I found out was anyone who studies this area knows is that these abductions are very often stopped with only one thing by claiming the blood and authority of Jesus Christ. 

That's the only thing I have ever heard that stops these abductions from going forward. They get stopped dead in their tracks and we have seen it over and over again. And these are all documented and you're getting more and every day you're getting more and more. They're still coming in, correct? Yeah, absolutely. Every time a new show like this one, you're going to have listeners that have never heard of me. 

But now they're going to get an opportunity to go, hey, I've done this. Now I know who I can talk to. Because the secular realm is not going to let you share this testimony. They don't want to hear it. They want to try and convince you that that's not real. So are you invited to UFO conferences? Are you still invited or they don't even want you there? No, they don't want me there. 

Best I can do is hold a conference myself or I can make myself a speaker, which I just did this weekend. Well, there has to be more people like you, correct? You're not the only one pushing this, right? There are a few, but at the most, they're know my work. I'm the only one that's been gathering the testimonies. Well, John D'Souza. Agrees with you. He does agree with I mean, is there anybody else that agree with you? Why don't you guys have your own conferences and disclosure on this? Yeah, that's a good question. 

And the question needs to be asked to them because available and I don't charge if you do show up to like a MUFON conference or something like that, do they kick you out or they just ignore you or how does this play out? Well, I know them all, so I'm friends with them. But if it's like the MUFON symposium, I'm not going to be asked to talk at that one. 

I can show up in the vendor area, set up a table and offer my books for sale and talk to people that way. And that's probably the best avenue for now. Until they want to open this door and allow this piece of the UFO puzzle to come to the table. It's going to stay the unwanted piece for quite some time. And they're remaining complicit in this because for what's coming. 

As we know this alien card they're going to play, it's going to be very important for people to know, to understand how faith plays a major role in this. Yeah. They're doing a massive disservice to themselves, to the community, and to God. Massive disservice, yes. The best opportunity to get this information out is through people like yourself, people that have a format to be able a platform to be able to share this information. 

You're going to have the opportunity with your listeners and your followers to reach thousands of people with this information. More than I could do by just going to one conference and talking to a few hundred. I think Sean Ryan, my budy Sean Ryan, would love to have you on his show. I'll ask him. I think you would do great on his show. You'd have to go in studio to see him, but he has a massive audience, and I think he's a Christian. 

I believe he's a reborn Christian, but he would probably and he covers this stuff, so you would be a huge component to his show. So I'm going to ask him. Sure, I'd love to. I have no problem going in studio if I got to go somewhere I can make that happen. Okay, so I'm going to segue into this for a second. Would you say that there is an outer space, there are other planets, there are other galaxies. 

Would you say there's other life on other planets, not sentient life like us? I don't think if we understand, you tell the New age people that and they'll lose their mind. I mean, they're going to tell you all the Palladians, and we were seeded from this galaxy, and we're from another solar system. And the reptilians, what about the reptilians? This is running our planet that are living coexisting with us. 

What's your thoughts on all of that? No, there's no coexisting. What they're thinking is there's possibly physical creatures here living with us. A lot of the UFO community believes in the idea of hybrids. Like from Dr. David Jacobs studies, we're not dealing with hybrids. The idea of a hybrid goes completely against everything that God speaks of on creation, and it goes against science, even. I mean, we can't even take a cat and a bird and make some kind of creature that flies the mix of the two. 

Why is that? And it never will happen. Because God in the beginning said everything was created after its kind, and he made sure that none of those kinds could be crossed. So the idea that these beings are making hybrids with humans falls into that same thing. We're not of the same kind. So to think that these hybrids can be made biologically with a mix of something that's spiritual or extra dimensional and us as physical excuse me, but that's science fiction. 

That's not science. Well, I've heard that, and I can kind of believe this, that these spirits are fallen. These entities are fallen. And what they're trying to do with these abductions is retain a soul. Trying to mix human DNA with their DNA to get a soul? They're trying to yeah, but they have no DNA. This is a spiritual entity. So what, you're saying this is all wow. Okay, I think I get what you're saying. 

Not even happening. What about people that find things? Okay, what about this people that have tracking devices on them? I know that they call them tracking devices, but they're objects. They're like shards objects or like metal metallic devices that are put inside them. Okay, so how do you explain that? Well, they think they're put inside of them because they got no other idea. Let me tell you something about how simple this thinking really needs to be done. 

And I take it back to my training with MUFON on. Simple is the best answer. And not to jump the most exaggerating ideas to get an answer, you got to go with the most simple that fits it. I had surgery on this finger years ago. Had to go into immediate surgery from work, and they removed a sliver of fiberglass out of my finger. Couldn't pull it out because it's barred. 

They had to cut the finger and pull it straight out. Well, I only saw the doctor when I went in for surgery at the hospital. I didn't see him in his office till two weeks later because I had to go but get stitches taken out. And when I went to his office in a different location than the hospital, and when I went into the room, I'm waiting on him as he's working on something before he starts talking to me. 

And I'm looking around, and there's this three foot by two foot board on the wall, and it's got all this garbage attached to it and little pieces of note under them, the date. And I said, Can I ask you a question? He said sure. I said, what is all that trash on that board? Why do you keep that? He says, Those are all the things that I dug out of people over the years in surgery. 

And he says, It's a bizarre mess of you name it, people will have things in them they have no idea. I said, Excuse me, what did you just say? And he says, A lot of these things I dig out of people, and they have no idea where they came from. I said, So why do they come to you? They do know they're there. And he says, Usually it begins to irritate them in some fashion, and we go and look at it and find out there's something in them. 

Then I end up removing it so it doesn't bother them anymore. But he says, yeah, most of them don't remember how they got it. It's that simple. It's not uncommon for people to get things in them that they don't understand where they came from. What's happening here is we're dealing with an entity that is around us right now. They're sitting next to me, they're sitting next to you, and they're sitting next to every one of your listeners and followers out there. 

They are in a realm that's adjacent to us. That's natural thing for them to be. They see everything that happens to us. They know everything that happens to us, even things that we don't remember. And if you're an experiencer and they're deceiving you, they will use that information that even you don't remember against you to perpetrate this delusion. Are you familiar with Charles Hall? Yeah. With the tall whites? Yeah, he said he was out, I think, in the desert of Nevada, and it would land, and they had children and they were tall whites, and they would grow to a certain height, and then the way they would die was because their organs couldn't hold up for their growth or something like that matter. 

The taller they were, was the older they were. Right. So what do you have to say to someone like that who says he saw these beings land? He saw their ship, he encountered them. They were very protective over their children. It seems like they were just another species. I believe he believes what he saw. Does he bring any evidence forward? No, that's the one thing that is missing in this entire field is evidence. 

We're listening to whistleblower after whistleblower after whistleblower in congressional hearings that bring what? Nothing. Hearsay. No evidence. The one thing I can bring to this field that nobody else is offering is evidence. Evidence of people who have had this experience that have had it terminated through a particular manner, and it's repeatable. Because I have people come to me and say, can you help me? And if I show them how it's worked for these people, and they accept and use that process also, lo and behold, we just repeated it because it happens to them. 

And I end up getting their testimony too. There's no repeatable events in the UFO phenomenon except this one. What about someone like Bob Lazar that worked on I think, wasn't he like engineering, reverse engineering mean? So was he imagining all this? No, I believe that parts of his story are true, but I believe that he's been put out there to perpetrate this delusion by forces that are trying to keep this on a different think. 

In other words, he's part of the same. Basically, yeah. I think David Grush is the same. He's just the new Bob Lazar. What about someone like Stephen Greer? Dr. Stephen Greer? Oh, jeez, sorry about know he's done some great work in getting us through this disclosure process, but at the same time he's selling a product that he's marketing, which is this app that he calls it Ce Five, where you can use these tones in a meditative state to contact these entities. 

That sounds dangerous to me in a meditative state. What are we talking about? Doesn't he have field trips? Doesn't he take people on trips to go and summon these UFOs? Yeah, big money. One of the first ones that I caught him on that made me really question what he was up to is he brought him to Florida on a beach in Florida and these lights started showing up out over the know. 

I can't tell you how many cases I worked on as a state section director here in Brevard County where the space center is located for MuPon, where those same cases is what people were seeing. And then what I found out is that they were flares being used for simulated bombing runs by the Air Force and the Navy out over the water. Wow. So did he know where this was happening? Maybe. 

What about cattle mutilations? Do you have an explanation for that? How do we explain that? I would keep that on the most simple observation. If you look at a map of all of the places where cattle mutilations happen, the epicenter is around the Four Corners states in our Midwest, nevada, Utah, New Mexico, Utah, Arizona, right around there. If you look at from there, where the epicenter of all the big hits are, and then it starts to get less and less and less and less and it stretches all the way across the country. 

And then I got to looking at that and I said, there's a definite pattern here. For some reason, something happened here in this epicenter near Farmington area in New Mexico that I had to look into. I said, why is this more concentrated here? And then it spreads out. And then I started looking real deep and I found this information on it's, public information, but it took some digging. 

1965 project Gas Buggy by the army. Project Gas Buggy was an idea concept for the use of underground atomic detonation to frack the ground for oil. And it was done near Farmington, New Mexico. That's right up the road from me. Yeah, it was actually done on Indian reservation. So what's been happening all these years is they believe that there could be a possible leak of radiation from the underground blast over time and God forbid we do anything more damaging to the Indian population. 

So there is a Bureau of Land Management office there in Farmington that is constantly investigating the environment area, all in that area. I'm not sure they know exactly what they think they're looking for, the ones that work for them. But these animals have their eyes taken out, their blood drained, soft tissue, organs is what you want to look for, for any signs of radiation, any signs of chemical warfare. 

Their organs are missing their organs. So how do you explain that? They can easily be taken, but I believe this is military ops. It's doing the testing, random testing on cattle and other animals on the soft tissue to look to see if there's any effects from that event. Let me ask you this one last question. What's your thoughts on wow, that's a that's a great story. I used to follow Billy Meyer in my early years of the research, but I just saw too many problems going on. 

I believe Billy actually had encounters. I believe that he was allowed to be a messenger for these entities. And we see this all through the phenomenon in the contactee experience where people may have had the horrific experiences in the beginning, and then the entities change. Then they end up becoming visited by the tall whites or the Nordics or the Pleiadians, I should say. And then they're being told that they went through all this for a special reason, a special purpose. 

They were chosen to be messengers for them of their so called alien gospel that they bring. And those are the hardest people for me to reach because they've been sold over by their experiences. In other words, what's happened to them is the good cop, bad cop experience. But they're both cops. What you're seeing there is the Stockholm syndrome, and it's the same thing we saw with POWs during wartime POWs that were totally traumatized, but by the time they were rescued, they were spouting the same political views of their captors. 

It's the Patty Hearst syndrome. Patty Hearst was captured and held captive, but all of a sudden we see her with an AK 47 robbing a bank with them because she got brainwashed by them. That's exactly what's happening with these experiences. Wow. Joseph, I won't take any more of your time. This has been incredible. Can you show everyone your book and where to get it again? Sure. Piercing the cosmic veil? You shall not be afraid of the dark by night. 

And this is available on Amazon, in paperback and in kindle. Beautiful, man. Joe, I really appreciate your been. You're a wealth of knowledge, man. This has been very eye opening for me. I'd love to have you on for another segment because I'd like to dive even deeper into this topic, if that's okay with you. Sure. There's so much more I mean yeah, there's so much to uncover here. 

I want to talk about NASA, what your thoughts are on NASA. And I want to talk about the coming alien card that they're going to play. Sure. Would that be okay with you? Oh, I'd love to. You want to do that now? No. Well, I have another guest right now. Let's do that on part two. Is that all right? Sure, I'd love to. I really want to know what your thoughts are on NASA. 

I mean, I really want to get into that. Okay. Thank you, Joe, very much. Thank you, Nino, for being courageous enough to bring this forward. Absolutely no problem on my end. Take care of yourself. Thank you. .